• Creator
    Topic
  • #11550
    Mailbox
    Flatchatter

      The insistence by Strata Managers that owners pay for lawyers to draw up a by-law for each renovation seems to me to be a case of ‘jobs for the boys’ price gouging, since all the lawyers need to do in the majority of cases is cutting and pasting previously passed by-laws.

      For example: I recently approached my Strata Manager with a major renovation by-law I had “drafted” – by which I mean I used the exact wording from one of half a dozen previously passed by-laws , but changed the lot number to my own. This is for a bathroom renovation. 

      I was initially told by the Strata Manager that I could not draw up my own by-law, but had to use a solicitor. The Strata Manager then emailed the preferred solicitor, cc’d me in, and asked that a cost disclosure be sent to me. This was promptly done, and I was asked to sign agreeing to pay $700 to have the by-law drawn up.  

      I contacted Fair Trading, who advised that it is not necessary to have a lawyer draw up the by-law. I conveyed this to the Strata Manager.  He then said that if I “insist” on drawing up the by-law myself, the Strata Committee would require their solicitor to review the by-law, and I would have to pay for that. How much? It would be about the same – $700.  The tone of the emails was disagreeable, to put it mildly.  

      Reviewing my Strata’s by-laws, I noted that the vast majority of renovation by-laws for bathrooms are identical apart from the lot number. Surely this is something that can be made into a tick-a-box template  paid for by the Owners Corporation?

      Then only owners seeking to do non-standard renovations would need to pay for a new by-law to be drawn up. Unfortunately all of the advice on this on the internet is put out there by lawyers – who clearly have a vested interest in convincing OCs that the approach is risky.  Is this something that Fair Trading could do?

    Viewing 10 replies - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
    • Author
      Replies
    • #29076
      BONNIE L
      Flatchatter

        I heard from a strata lawyer speaker recently that a by-law prepared by a lawyer stood a stronger chance of ‘standing up’   Took that to mean protective of the client.

        Getting on the committee is another way of influencing what you may want to happen. 

        #29301
        Ziggy
        Flatchatter

          I have an even more bizarre issue regarding bylaws and strata managers. At a recent SC meeting, it was approved that I can put an awning on a common property fascia, where there was one before.

          At the meeting, the SM said they would forward me a copy of their Bylaw template to make things easier. When this did not turn up, I emailed the SM who said that the Bylaw was intellectual property and that they would not send it to me.

          At a previous general meeting the OC resolved in favour of having a Bylaw that would allow owners to do minor works to common property. 

          So where does that leave me? Do I still need a Bylaw, and, like mailbox, do I need to get a lawyer to write one?

          #29302
          Lady Penelope
          Strataguru

            Ziggy – You mentioned that an awning had existed prior to your recent application, therefore I am assuming that a by-law for the previous awning also exists. Precedent exists for your awning. This is always a good thing!

            Can you search the Strata records (or ask the SM) for a copy of the by-law that previously existed for this works? Perhaps, with some minor adjustments to suit your specific application, you could re-use the previous by-law.

            You do not need a lawyer to write a by-law for you, nor should the OC or SM mandate that this is required. Such a requirement could be deemed to be “unreasonable”.

            That being said, there are certain issues with awnings that need to be considered when drafting a by-law for awnings and blinds. 

            #29304
            Ziggy
            Flatchatter

              Hi Lady P, I don’t believe there was a previous bylaw for an awning, despite two previous owners installing them; one on my property and one next door.

              The SM doesn’t intend to deal with me any further and the SC are not responding to my emails for the bylaw template. At a previous meeting the SC agreed that I could install the awning although nothing came of this. And at the latest SC meeting it was resolved to approve the awning subject to me submitting a by-law for the owners approval. As I said, the SM said they would send me one but has now reneged.

              I have followed all the appropriate rules and regulations and have supplied this to the SC.

              It must be remembered, at a GM last year, the OC, including the SC obviously, approved a minor works to common property renovation bylaw.

              #29305
              scotlandx
              Strataguru

                That is hilarious, the by-law is not intellectual property, or if it is, any rights would belong to the person who drafted it.

                Any owner must be provided with a copy of the by-laws, just tell the strata manager to provide you with a full set of them, and then use the relevant by-law to draft yours.

                #29306
                Ziggy
                Flatchatter

                  The SM is no longer communicating with me. While I was on the SC, they refused to give me a copy of the strata roll, as did the SC. 

                  By the way, the same SM sends out minutes of meetings weeks after the due date, allows SC members to vote on issues without being financial, spends money on things without approval from the OC, and chairs all meetings despite the presence of the SC chair. They also take weeks to respond to issues such as flooding from broken pipes.

                  So, I would like to know about the legality of the previous approved renovations bylaw. Is that not valid?

                  #29307
                  Lady Penelope
                  Strataguru

                    Ziggy – As Scotlandx has suggested, if I was you I would be asking for a copy of the By-laws just to check whether anyone has ever previously had a By-law for their awning approved by the OC, and then Registered.

                    Your SM cannot refuse to deal with you. If they do then they are in breach of their Contract.

                    If there is no By-law then you can write your own By-law. I am not a lawyer so any suggestions as to the wording of a By-law that I may make are not to be relied upon.

                    My suggestion is this:

                    Awning By-law for Lot xxxxx

                    As a condition of the Owners Corporation of Strata Scheme xxxxxxx approving the installation of an awning affixed to the Common Property fascia located at  Lot xxxx, the Owner of Lot xxxx agrees to the following:

                    (a) the size of the awning will be xxxxcm Wide and  xxxxcm Long; and

                    (b) the awning will be constructed of xxxxxxxxx and the colour will be xxxxxxx; and

                    (c) all work will be carried out by suitably qualified and licensed tradespeople; and

                    (d) the Owner will be responsible for the cost of the awning and its installation and all ongoing cleaning and maintenance of the awning; and

                    (e) the Owner will be responsible for any damage to Common Property that may result from the installation and  the use of the awning, and any consequences of any damage the awning may cause to other property.

                    #29308
                    Ziggy
                    Flatchatter

                      Thanks so much Lady P and Scotlandx. My neighbour tried to write a bylaw (in collaboration with his lawyer) and was knocked back by the SM. The SM said my neighbour had to use a bylaw written by a lawyer recommended by the SM. 

                      I presume the same will happen if I write one. I will try though and ask that it be placed on the upcoming GM. But I guarantee, the SM will not accept it.

                      Could I just put the awning up, bearing in mind the previous approvals and the renovations to common property bylaw already passed?

                      #29310
                      Lady Penelope
                      Strataguru

                        Ziggy – When you submit the By-law Motion I would recommend that you also include the following information in your accompanying correspondence:

                        (1) That you are well aware that there is no requirement under the Act that a lawyer must create all By-laws for the Scheme. Nor is there a requirement under the Act that a particular lawyer must create all By-laws for the Scheme. For the SM or the SC to allege that these matters are a requirement under the Act is clearly false.

                        (2) That any subsequent check by a lawyer of the By-law is to be at the expense of the Owner’s Corporation being that there are no provisions under the Act to pass this financial burden on to you, the submitter of the By-law Motion.

                        (3) That it is not the responsibility of the Strata Manager or the Strata Committee to approve By-laws. The responsibility to approve By-laws rests with the members of the Owner’s Corporation at a General Meeting.

                        (4) That you expect that your By-law Motion will be included within the Agenda of the next General Meeting as per the Act, and that the Motion is to be voted on by the members of the Owner’s Corporation, and if approved is Registered as per the Act.

                        (5) That if the Strata Manager or the Strata Committee for the Owner’s Corporation continues to frustrate your attempts to have an awning erected that you will have no other choice but to take this matter to Mediation and/or to NCAT, particularly in view of the existing precedents i.e. the fact that an awning has previously been erected at your Lot, and that other Owners have been permitted to erected an awning.

                        (6) That the Strata Manager is to acknowledge in writing the receipt of your letter and your By-law Motion.

                        NB: At the next available opportunity I would seek to have your SM’s contract not be renewed. Based on the information that you have provided he/she is clearly not fulfilling their job in a satisfactory or competent manner. 

                        #29313
                        Ziggy
                        Flatchatter

                          Thanks so much Lady P. Your response has given me new hope.

                        Viewing 10 replies - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
                        • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.