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  • #8749
    Jimmy-T
    Keymaster

      There are some very good reasons for the plan to force limiters to be fitted on to strata windows to stop young kids falling out of them.  The fact that strata buildings tend to be higher is obvious but there’s also the simple fact that it can be easily policed.

      Under proposals issued by NSW Fair Trading, from May 1st this year, all new  medium and high rise buildings will be required to have some sort of device on windows one floor up and above, that limit their opening to 125 mm. This is a response to nearly 40 children having been hospitalized last year after falling from windows.

      With high-rises sprouting like mushrooms, developers have had to be ordered to install these safety devices because, let’s face it, most weren’t going to do it voluntarily.  Some of them cut so many corners it’s a surprise their blocks aren’t cylindrical.

      OK, so much for new buildings.  But what about the existing 70,000 strata plans in NSW.  Some, such as townhouse developments, aren’t going to need to do anything if their buildings are low rise.

      The rest of us are going to have to come up with some sort of retro-fit plan but, to avoid a cavalry charge of cowboys cashing in on an arbitrary deadline, Minister Anthony Roberts has allowed for a five-year grace period for us all to catch up.

      But why us and not two-storey houses, for instance? As I said before, it’s partly because Fair Trading know they can enforce this in strata.

      You see, your windows probably aren’t yours at all.  They’ll be common property.  And even if you really, really don’t want to fit limiters, your Owners Corp not only has a legal obligation to do so but has the right to enter your property to get it done.

      And that’s why strata apartment blocks will be leading the way on child safety. Oh, by the way, you can still have windows that open all the way, provided there is a child-proof limiter installed.

      You can read the discussion document HERE and you can join in a lively debate on the issue HERE.

      The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
    Viewing 8 replies - 1 through 8 (of 8 total)
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    • #18127
      DD
      Flatchatter

        Hi Jimmy,

        where did you find the info re “you can still have windows that open all the way, provided there is a child proof limiter installed”.

        Do you have some other BCA or NCC document which says otherwise?… please forward as we are struggling to follow the changes.

        #18130
        Jimmy-T
        Keymaster
        Chat-starter

          @DD said:
          Hi Jimmy,

          where did you find the info re “you can still have windows that open all the way, provided there is a child proof limiter installed”.

          Page 11 of the Fair Trading discussion document says this:

          Safety devices designed to be locked and unlocked so that the window can be secured in more than one position must:
          • be capable of restricting the window opening to 125mm;
          • be strong enough to withstand the pressure exerted by a child; and
          • have security or design features to prevent a child from unlocking it.

          That clearly refers to a device that can lock a window at 125mm but is capable of being unlocked and opened wider (but not by a small child).

          The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
          #18136
          Boronia
          Flatchatter

            I would be concerned that a window that can be opened more than 125 mm by an adult can be left open and forgotten about.

            #18138
            Jimmy-T
            Keymaster
            Chat-starter

              It’s the same principle as the pool fence. You can’t guarantee that a gate will be left locked at all times but you CAN guarantee that it won’t be locked if there is no lock. We have to allow for basic human needs (like fresh air and window cleaning) and we have to let people make their own mistakes. Also, this is a discussion document so there’s still time to put up an argument against locking (rather than limiting) devices.

              The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
              #18139
              DD
              Flatchatter

                Thanks Jimmy,

                I tend to agree that if you (Owners Corp and or Landlord)  have completed due dilagence then it is upto the individual resident to comply.

                Ps. with tounge in cheekSurprised, maybe we should put a ball and chain on all childen to stop them running and jumping out of windows in Strata.Laugh

                #18157
                1jasper
                Flatchatter

                  Jimmy

                  I have a couple of queries in regards to this window topic relating to CHILD SAFETY. The proposals to instal devices to restrict the window opening may be in contradiction with the wording/requirements of the Building Code of Australia (BCA) and stand to create confusion due to inconsistencies.

                  Firstly, given the proposal for windows – one or more floors up to be fitted with locking devices to restrict the width of the window openings to less than 125mm to prevent children from falling through the window opening, how do they propose to get around the NCC/BCA requirement for natural ventilation of habitable rooms? NCC/BCA requires a minimum window openiing of 5% of the floor area of the room for natural ventilation as shown below;

                  F4.6 Natural ventilation
                  Natural ventilation provided in accordance with F4.5(a) must consist of permanent openings,
                  windows, doors or other devices which can be opened—
                  (a) with an aggregate opening or openable size not less than 5% of the floor area of the room required to be ventilated; and
                  (b) open to—
                  (i) suitably sized court, or space open to the sky; or
                  (ii) an open verandah, carport, or the like; or
                  (iii) an adjoining room in accordance with F4.7.

                  To install such restriction devices on the existing windows limiting the opening width where the window opening was designed to meet the minimum ventilation requirement would be in contradiction of the requirements of the BCA.

                   

                  Secondly, the BCA (now NCC) has consistently, and for many years required that windows 4m above the ground or surface below have means by which falls are prevented- including for children: This is referenced in BCA volume 1 part D performance requirement DP3 which states;

                  Where people could fall—

                  (b) 4 m or more from a floor through an openable window, a barrier must be provided which must be—
                  (c) continuous and extend for the full extent of the hazard; and
                  (d) of a height to protect people from accidentally falling from the floor or roof or through the opening; and
                  (e) constructed to prevent people from falling through the barrier; and
                  (f) capable of restricting the passage of children; and
                  (g) of strength and rigidity to withstand—
                  (i) the foreseeable impact of people; and
                  (ii) where appropriate, the static pressure of people pressing against it.

                  The suggestion that the window opening restriction be limited to less than 125mm to stop kids getting through has been compared to the performance of swimming pool fences, and yet the gap in pool fences is restricted to less than 100mm, not the 125 now proposed for the windows. To my knowledge 100mm has been the limited width of any window opening  as for the pool fence facing onto a pool area for a long time. This new proposal seems to be inconsistent with children getting through the barrier as required for pool fences, and is more in line with the 125mm ball test requirement for balustrades. Why is there two different gap specifications when both relate to the same children?

                  #18172
                  Kangaroo
                  Flatchatter

                    As 1jasper points out, it will be interesting to see which piece of legislation overrides the other, the Building Code of Australia or the Strata Schemes Management Act.

                    At the moment they are proposing to allow permanent restriction of opening width, which of course has unintended ventilation consequences.

                    The cheapest way for the OC to achieve this is to screw a block of alumimium down into the bottom track. Doesn’t even need a full-width dowell. Owners who desire to breathe fresh air could remove the aluminium block and install keyed window locks or crim-safe flyscreens at their own expense.

                    Maybe, further down the line, the NSW Government intends to compel OCs to install air-conditioning for each lot to provide the ventilation necessary for the safe raising of children.

                    I suppose that’s one solution to global warming – give everyone an air-conditioner so they can stay cool !!!

                    Perhaps the NSW Government would also care to recommend how OCs address the cost issue of responsible parents who have already installed window locks now having to contribute for the fitting of window locks to irresponsible parents’ lots? Should we reimburse responsible parents for costs already incurred?

                    Has anyone else noticed the diametrically opposed solutions for child safety in strata blocks and around schools?

                    In strata blocks we’re going to lock the kids in. At schools, instead of locking them in with a fence, they’re allowed to run out onto the road, and every driver passing by, for eternity, has to slown down after noticing the myriad of signs and flashing lights.

                    #18173
                    Boronia
                    Flatchatter

                      @Kangaroo said:At schools, instead of locking them in with a fence, they’re allowed to run out onto the road, and every driver passing by, for eternity, has to slown down after noticing the myriad of signs and flashing lights.

                      Are you suggesting that kids shouldn’t be allowed to go home?

                      Most schools do keep their gates locked during the day, but I think more in an effort to keep bad people out.

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