Forum Replies Created
-
AuthorReplies
-
hi drshelley,
Thanks for that. You are right. Although there is plenty of advice around among the current discussions as well as in the archived database, you still feel that your case is different. Specific advice would be much helpful.
Would you be able to send instructions of how you’d like us to contact you through flatchatadvice01@gmail.com
Many thanks
Dear drshelley,
Congrats on a positive result. I do hope things go well with you with the rest of the process.
Would you mind if we contact you privately to ask a few specific questions?
hi drshelley,
Thanks for your kind empathy. Would you be able to elaborate a bit more on your past experience. Did you experience the same type of noise as we are i.e thumping/thudding and what was the outcome of your tribunal?
The whole thing has been taking a big toll on us. We dont enjoy being home anymore yet we cant sell the place and move on because it would cause a lot of other issues for us. What makes it more difficult in our case is that other neighbours are not willing to do anything or complain about these tenants. There was a lady in here before us and she used to complain to the next door neighbour(we learnt this only recently) about the noise but chose to do nothing. In these tenants’ argument we are being unreasonable because they’ve been in this building before us and had no complaints.
Anyway, we sent to their REA a letter last week warning him of further including legal actions on the landlord as Jimmy has suggested. No response from him yet.
The SM promised to send us the paperwork for the penalty application but so far we received nothing. Our phone calls to his office appeared to conveniently miss him all the times. He’s either out of the office or always on other calls.
Fair trading advised me yesterday that the REA is obglided to act if there are more than one complainants so I just sent copies of two letters I collected to him this morning. Are we correct in assuming the REA would pass all the information onto the land lord and he is fully aware of what’s going on in case we do take legal actions against the landlord?
However, the lady at Fair Trading told me it would be hard to deal with this issue if they blame it all on the kids because the running and jumping from kids can be considered ‘expected normal daily living noise’. When I disputed this, she corrected it as ‘running and jumping to 8.30 -9.00pm’. This seems to contradict on the response from the police to my enquries of what time noise can be considered ‘offensive’. I quote the police response below
Thank you for contacting the NSW Police Force Customer Assistance Unit.
Noise can be considered ‘Offensive’ at any time of the night or day. If you are being disturbed by noise that you consider to be unreasonable you should ring your local Police and ask them to attend and speak to the persons involved.
so anyone knows there is a quantitative definition of ‘normal living noise’?
Many thanks,
Hi Jimmy and strata gurus,
I spoke with the SM today and asked if he was authorised to pursue for a penalty on these tenants as per the motion we submitted (but SM’s wording) and was passed at the last AGM. His answer was ‘yes’ but he said we would need to submit the application to the EC for approval before sending it in. Is this correct? I would have thought he has got the authorisation to go ahead with the penalty application if necessary (the minute on the motion is quoted on my 8th post of this topic).
If this is true, as Jimmy pointed out, this would be my hurdle as the EC members did not want to get involved with the issue from the start.
Thanks,
hi Jimmy,
I think the motion was passed at the last AGM that the strata manager is authorised to issue the NTC and apply for penalties against the tenant. I will check with the strata manager tomorrow on this.
If the strata manager is authorised to apply for a penalty and proceeds with the penalty application, are we required to be accessible in the time leading up to or present at the Tribunal?
Hi Jimmy and strata gurus
We have decided to pursue for a penalty to be imposed on the tenant as our first and immediate action. However, we do have a couple of questions.
We undestand from reading the SSMA Act that the pursuit of a penalty comes under section 203 of the act, which reads
Civil penalties for contravention of notice of owners corporation
(1) The Tribunal may, on application by an owners corporation, by order require a person to pay a pecuniary penalty of an amount of up to 5 penalty units if the Tribunal is satisfied that:
(a) the owners corporation served a notice under section 45 on the person requiring the person to comply with a particular by-law, and
(b) the person has since contravened the by-law.
(2) An application for an order under this section must be made by the owners corporation within 12 months after the notice under section 45 was served.
The notice to comply was issued early December 2013, which was followed up by two further warning letters dated late December 2013 and late January. Are we correct in assuming that we just need to prove that the tenant continued making noise after the notice of comply was issued ?
Also as we are going away in 3 weeks, we think it may be better to submit our application after we come back. This way, we can supply any information should it required by the adjuncator. We also dont want them to vandalise our place while we are away. However, all our supporting letters or witness statements are dated early January. Will they still have relevance if we submit our application in say mid-May.
Many thanks,
Hi Jimmy.
Much appreciated for the helpful information.
I just read the minutes of the last AGM meeting and the minute on our motion reads
Resolved that the Managing agent is authorised to issue a notice to comply for breach of by-law 1 and by-law 1 reads:
By-law 1 Noise …….
The Managing agent is authorised to issue a notice under section 45 of the Strata Schemes Management Act and apply for a pecuniary penalty from the Tribunal in respect of the occupier of Lot XXX creating noise.
Looks like the strata manager has been authorised to apply for a penalty without the need for another meeting or futher instruction from the EC.
Can we apply to a tribunal while requesting for a penalty to be imposed or one must take place before the other.
Dave B, Jimmy and Scotlandx,
I may have misled you guys with the laundry thing. I must correct that it is not a laundry located on the balcony but an external laundry accessed via the balcony. What they do is clean the laundry (or the balcony) and throw things on the balcony floor in the process. My apologies for the misinformation.
We do think we might have been approaching the issue too softly (or we have been too nice to them). This has also not been helped by the reactions from the EC members. In fact, we approached all EC members for support but ‘it is not their issue because it doesnt affect them that much’. All EC members have told us ‘it’s the strata manager’s job, not ours’. Also, the kids excuse appears to start gaining some sympathy from other neighbours.
We have kept a ‘record’ book of the noise events for the last 6 months but we feel it’s still our words against theirs. So far we have managed to get 2 letters from neighbours (one of them is an EC member) stating they heard the noise at specific times in our unit, 1 letter from another EC member stating she heard the noise from her unit and 1 complaint letter from someone in the building next door, who hears the screaming and shouting. All these letters state the noise is disturbing, disruptive and unpleasant. Would these be sufficient evidence to prove to the tribunal member that they make excessive noise. Would the Tribunal be buying the ‘kids will run and scream’ excuse? Because we have had no experience dealing with this, we fear that if we fail at the tribunal, it will be a lot worse (in fact on several occassions now they appeared to make noise delibrately).
I have tried to record the noise for more irrefutable evidence with my phone and my camera but it didnt pick up this noise very well. Anyone knows what recording device would piick this low frequency noise up?
We did speak with the local police about the issue and asked if they would assist. Their response was they would. But we havent called them because i feel it might look excessive to call police to deal with the ‘so called ‘kids noise’. Has anyone got any experience with calling the police on this kind of noise?
If we press for a penalty on them, how do we proceed with this action?
Many thanks
-
AuthorReplies