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Basically, this is a scheme you can lock into and save money and if you don’t think you are saving money, you pullout. No harm, no foul.
Yes, Strata Choice are our major sponsors but that’s because we trust them. If they were dodgy they wouldn’t be on the website.
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There is a limit to what you can and/or need to do before the first AGM and strata committee is elected (which markf the end of the Initial Period to which you will see references)
You should get a professional inspection of the interior of your unit now so that the developer can’t claim wear and tear. But as for common property, that is a much bigger task that must be undertaken by the Owners Corp and I have extracted the section of the Act that deals with that. It’s a bit of a read.
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We have English speaking people in our building who can’t or won’t read notices and do throw stuff off their balconies. Cigarette ends are a favourite because, to smokers, the world is their ashtray.
But the idea of notices in other languages is good – just as long as it doesn’t feel like you are targetting them.
It’s a bit like people who complain about tenants when it turns out the culprits are owners.
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This is a much more common problem that you would think (and it’s one of the reasons I would never buy a terrace apartment).
But there is a simple solution. A relatively cheap web cam, positioned at the front edge of your terrace and pointing up, recording on to a laptop at, say, one frame a second, would not only identify the culprits pretty quickly but give you evidence to take to NCAT to have them breached and fined.
Cameras and software are cheap (the latter may be free) so all you need is a hand 14-year-old to set it all up for you.
Or, a notice in the lift saying you have installed security cameras pointing up at the balconies might have the deterrent effect you require.
If you can identify the balcony, then a Notice To Comply can be sent to the resident, whether it was them or a visitor, as they are responsible for the behaviour of people they invite into the building.
And before anyone says anything, no this is not an invasion of privacy, providing you are not filming people getting their kit off or doing anything they would otherwise expect to be private.
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I agree with Stevecro. There are processes available to you and if you can prove that committee members have benefitted at the expense of other owners than you should pursue them.
If you can find a strata manager prepared to be nominated as a statutory appointment, that would be the first test of whether you have a case or not.
If you can’t get a strata manager on board then you could seek orders at NCAT compelling the owners who have defrauded the owners corp to repay the money. But that will require proof, as will any other option you may be considering.
Feeling excluded from the process and then seeing others on the inside apparently benefitting is not evidence of fraud.
You would be better to ask for what you want on the same terms as the others and then challenge that specifically when it is refused.
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You are more likely to find that council planning laws might prevent the changes. City of Sydney’s by-laws say you need a DA if you are changing the configuration of the rooms (this is to prevent noisier rooms like bathrooms being positioned above or next to quiet rooms like bedrooms in other units). But all you do is get the builder to say it’s a complying development and it all goes through anyway.
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PS is 100 per cent right on this and it’s a much more common occurrence than you would think. It starts in an older building that had a common laundry (and we are talking coppers, sinks and wringers) then the first person to buy a washing machine put it in there, then the second and then there was no room for any more but the concept of Buggins’ turn rather than common property prevailed. Meanwhile, often the washing machine owners would be using electricity supplied by the owners corp.
I know this becasue it happened in a building where I used to own a flat.
There is a very simple solution but it will take a bit of wrangling to get to it.
Firstly, you have to persuade the incumbent owners that they are taking unfair advantage of everyone else. This may not work.
Then you have to convince them that it is relatively easy to take this to the tribunal and force them to remove their washing machines from common property and pay back a share of the electricty they have used at everyone else’s expense.
Now this might get their attention. This will be signalled by huffing and puffing, not to mention shouting and swearing – but you have made progress.
So then you sit down and try to work out a compromise so that anyone who wants to use the laundry can do so and pay appropriately for the privilege.
The simplest solution is to get two credit card or coin operated washing machines and dryers installed. I believe modern versions work on swipe cards too, removing any security concerns. Just Google coin operated laundry for strata and the names of half a dozen firms will come up.
The only remaining problems are the machines owned by the laundry squatters. Preferably, you would leave it to them to remove and dispose of as they wish. Or the owners corp could buy them off them at a nominal price and recoup some of the money by selling them to a second-hand whitegoods dealer.
What you don’t need to do is accept the status quo. The phrase or even concept of “we have always done it this way” does not appear in the strata laws or regulations.
It’s one of those situations where, even if the committee doesn’t want to change, you can get orders at NCAT to force them to abide by strata laws and regs. The only question they have to answer is this: do they want to do it the hard way or the easy way – because either way, it will be done.
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I would take this a stage further and advise that the owners corp needs to take action on this as a matter of urgency.
Firstly becasue this is effectively a land grab that prebvents other owners or the whole strata scheme from installing solar panels and secondly becasue is the owner sells without a formal by-law in place, the owners corp assumes responsibility for the maintenance and upkeep of the solar panels.
I’m sure a compromise can be reached if all parties are willing. However, the owner should be told in no uncertain terms that if they aren’t prepared to pay for an acceptable by-law covering the installation, they will be ordered to remove it at their expense then billed for any residual damage.
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@HillsAnn said:
The agreement has a clause that the agreement can be terminated at any time by MUTUAL agreement. Presumably as long as the company has been operating according to the new laws, they could refuse to accept the owners corporation request to terminate?Why would the Owners Corp want to terminate if the strata managers have been fulfilling their contract?
Is that correct? Can the OC determine the length of the agreement and the period of notice to terminate? It would be more logical to have the end date of the agreement fall 3 months after our normal AGM.
Strata management contracts are like any other (apart from the three year limit). The terms can be negotiated at the beginning of the contract by both parties. If one or other party doesn’t agree, they don’t sign. And if neither party breaches the terms of the contract then it runs its course.
Here is section 50 of the Act, which lays out the basic terms governing strata management contracts.
50 Term of appointment of strata managing agents
(1) The term of appointment (including any additional term under an option to renew) of a strata managing agent for a strata scheme expires (if the term of the appointment does not end earlier or is not ended earlier for any other reason):
(a) if the strata managing agent is appointed by the owners corporation at the first annual general meeting, at the end of the period of 12 months following that appointment, or
(b) in any other case, at the end of the period of 3 years following the appointment.
(2) A person may be reappointed by the owners corporation by resolution at a general meeting as the strata managing agent for a strata scheme at the end of the person’s term of appointment.
(3) The appointment of a strata managing agent may be terminated in accordance with the instrument of appointment if authorised by a resolution at a general meeting of the owners corporation.
(4) The term of appointment of a strata managing agent may be extended by the strata committee for successive periods of up to 3 months after it would otherwise expire (but not for any period that would extend beyond the date of the next annual general meeting of the owners corporation) pending a decision as to the reappointment of the strata managing agent.
(5) However, if a strata committee has extended a term of appointment of a strata managing agent under this section, the strata committee must give the strata managing agent at least 1 month’s notice of a decision not to reappoint the strata managing agent or not to further extend the appointment.
(6) A strata managing agent must give the owners corporation written notice of the end of a term of appointment:
(a) at least 3 months before the end of the term of appointment, and
(b) at least 1 month before the end of each extension of a term permitted by this section.
(7) An instrument of appointment of a strata managing agent for a period of 3 years (as referred to in subsection (1) (b)) is taken to include an option for the agent to extend the term of the appointment for a maximum period of 3 months after the end of the term of 3 years, if the owners corporation decides not to reappoint the agent and does not extend the term of appointment under subsection (4). The agent must give the owners corporation written notice of the exercise of the option.
(8) A strata managing agent is not entitled to exercise an option under subsection (7) if the owners corporation gives the agent written notice that the agent will not be reappointed at least 3 months before the end of the term.
(9) In this section, a reference to the appointment of a strata managing agent includes a reference to the reappointment of a strata managing agent.If you want to be alerted when anyone replies to your posts or responds to this topic, please register and login, then you will be able to subscribe to the topic. The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers. NB: Longer threads may spill over to additional pages - look for the numbers on the bottom right, under the last post.
The appropriate response would be “Please don’t quote non-existent laws at me” followed by “if you don’t want to represent people, why did you join a committee?” And that would be followed by “oh, I get it, to serve your own interests!”
“Invasion of privacy” is a made-up law but the critical thing here is a committee member refusing to engage with owners to discuss issues relevant to the strata scheme.
The long game on this is to start a website or newsletter alerting other owners to the problem so that these people get voted off at the next AGM (if enough of them agree with you).
The short game is to put motions on to the agenda for your next EC meeting and then turn up and ask to speak. If they don’t allow you to, ask for that to be minuted.
Other options include
Applying to NCAT for an interim order preventing them from spending the money.
Filling in a form requesting mediation at Fair Trading.
Applying to NCAT for orders under section 232.
You have options but a first step should be a letter to the secretary asking them how owners are expected to communiate with the committee and how the committee should be expected to respond. Just that. No “he said, she said”. A simple question requiring a straight answer.
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OK, here’s an option. The new Strata Regulations (below) allow for vehicles that “obstruct the use of common property” to be moved to somewhere they are allowed to be parked after due notice has been given.
I reckon a notice that said that, in a way that complied with the regs, would be enough to scare most rogue parkers off. If it didn’t, you could then decide whether you wanted to find out if it was legal or not by actually shifting the offending car and seeing what happened.
I am not a lawyer but I think it would be worth a spin. What’s the worst that could happen?
By the way, it would help greatly if you had a by-law that defined who could use visitor parking and for how long. That way you can prove they are not a bona fide visitor and are therefor obstructing the use of common property.
Meanwhile I have created a “Move it or lose it” pdf form that you can download and print by clicking on that link. You should check with your strata manager or lawyer before using it. But at the very least it could be a bluff that’s unlikely to be called.
Fill in the form with the time and date, add the phone number of someone who doesn’t mind being verbally abused over the phone, take two pictures, one of the form on the car, the other of the car with the form on it, and see what happens.
I’d be interested to hear what the rest of you reckon to this.
NSW Strata Schemes Regulations (2016)
34 Removal of motor vehicles: section 125 of Act
(1) This clause applies to a motor vehicle left on common property that is placed so that it blocks an exit or entrance or otherwise obstructs the use of common property (my emphasis).
(2) The owners corporation may take action under this clause if the owners corporation has placed a removal notice on or near the motor vehicle and the requirements of the notice are not complied with within the period specified in the removal notice.
(3) A removal notice must:
(a) not be less than the size of an A4 piece of paper, and
(b) be placed in a position or be in a material so that the contents of the notice are not likely to be detrimentally affected by weather, and
(c) describe the motor vehicle and state the date and time the notice was issued, and
(d) state that the motor vehicle will be removed if it is not moved from the
common property or so that it no longer obstructs common property before the date and time specified in the notice (being not earlier than 5 days after the notice was placed on or near the motor vehicle), and
(e) specify contact details for a member of the strata committee, the strata
managing agent or a delegate of the owners corporation in relation to the
notice.
(4) The owners corporation may cause a motor vehicle to be moved to another place on common property or to the nearest place to which it may be lawfully moved, or moved so that it no longer blocks an exit or entrance or otherwise obstructs the use of common property, and for that purpose the owners corporation is taken to be the owner of the motor vehicle.
(5)The Tribunal may, on application by the owners corporation, order that the owner of a motor vehicle moved to another place under this clause, pay to the owners corporation the reasonable costs incurred by the owners corporation in moving the motor vehicle.
(6)In this clause:
motor vehicle has the same meaning as in the Impounding Act 1993.If you want to be alerted when anyone replies to your posts or responds to this topic, please register and login, then you will be able to subscribe to the topic. The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers. NB: Longer threads may spill over to additional pages - look for the numbers on the bottom right, under the last post.
Problem caused by owners corp, then. They have to fix the ceiling anyway because it’s common property but they may balk at the paint.
There’s a weird quirk in the “who’s responsible …” document that sayd the OC is responsible for repairing lot property when it is damaged while effecting a repair, but not for the damage caused by the failure of common property in the first place.
However, common law says that if something belonging to you damages something belonging to me, then you are liable.
Usually your home and contents insurance will pay for the paint job but if you don’t have cover (naughty, naughty) you could take the owners corp to a small claims court and demand payment there.
If there is anyone with an iota of sense on your committee, they will pay up and claim against their insurance. If their insurance is invalidated because they got someone who wasn’t qualified or insured to fit the leaf trap, it’s hardly your fault.
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The owners corp seems to be working on a “least said, soonest mended” basis. Firstly, you should talk to our sponsors Magnatex about how this should be handled – they are the experts.
The lifting and replacing of carpet is the least of your concerns but you would imagine that would be part of the scope of works once it has been established that there is a problem and therefore come under the Owners Corp’s responsibility.
For schemes under 100 units, it is accepted that they only need to post minutes and agendas on the notice board. However, you can request that your secretary emails you a copy or posts it to you at your expense.
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Washing machine flooding is the responsibility of the owner of the washing machine. Their insurance should cover it but if it doesn’t, and the Owners Corp insurance declines to pay, then the owner of the washing machine should be billed by the owners corp for the damage or any excess on their insurance.
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