[Wolf]

After we prompted the EC by saying “due to non response, we are going to proceed with our plans” an EC meeting was convened yesterday.

During the EC meeting yesterday the guy who appears to have a personal vendetta against us railed against a dog in the apartment, repeating again the 10 reasons he used for our 1st application. His rant included “dog sh1t everywhere,” “cruelty to animals,” “insurance liability will go through the roof” and “you have NO respect for other owners and have NOT taken into account other people’s views on this”

Unbeknownst to him we had actually previously flyered the other owners requesting their feedback on our application. 3 responses came back supporting our application from other owners and 1 owner actually turned up to the EC meeting. So he’s just coming across as loonybins at this stage.

We argued reason and the other owner present at the meeting weighed in, saying that if we took this to NCAT we’d win this time. The other EC members decided it wasn’t worth the prolonged fight. In the end the EC voted 4 to 2 to allow us the dog as long as we signed a page listing out our commitments as pet owners.

Lessons learned from this that may be useful to others:

• Get on the EC the first chance you have
• Don’t try to argue with stupid, you won’t win
• If your bylaws allow a dog under reasonable conditions and you’re confident your dog will not cause a nuisance to others, bring the dog on property, then apply for permission
• Get support from the other residents
• Wait for the EC to take you to NCAT.

Thanks for everyone’s feedback and support. It took 9 months but we now have permission for a dog. 🙂

[Wolf]

Hi! Just thought I’d update quickly.

We submitted a second application to adopt my friend’s adult small dog a month ago and have heard nothing back since. We’ve given them 4 weeks and so far, nothing.

We called the strata manager who said that the “EC are discussing the application but no reply has been received.”

Now, my husband is on the EC but he hasn’t been part of any “discussion.” No EC meeting has been convened, no notice of an upcoming meeting has been put up. 

My friend wants me to confirm with her soon, as she’s looking after the dog while juggling full time work and a newborn with autism and would like me to help her by adopting it.

How long should I be expected to wait? The strata manager has said that “permission has not been granted, so you shouldn’t keep the dog on the property” but equally, permission has not been withheld, and I feel like they are just delaying their response because they are casting about for more soothsaying reasons to say no!

Should I bring the dog on the property and gather evidence that it is not a nuisance e.g. letters from neighbours to the effect that it doesn’t bark constantly and loudly, and that we are managing waste and hygiene sufficiently while waiting for the EC to get back to us?

[Wolf]

struggler – Thanks! Words of encouragement that are sorely needed! 

As expected, we have lost our appeal – we just got our letter from NCAT. The Member’s responses are completely divergent from the points we were trying to make during our appeal. 

On the plus side, in speaking to some friends of mine, they need to find a home for their dog due to a change in their circumstances. The dog is a small adult pure bred Bichon Frise and they’ve asked if I will adopt him. 

Given that I’ve lost the appeal and have already told the shelter to let the original dog be rehomed (we were top of the list and they were holding her for us) somewhere else, I will be putting in another application for this different dog. 

We’ll just keep asking until the EC says yes eventually! It will be interesting to see what other ridiculous soothsaying they come up with next. 

JimmyT – I hope this doesn’t impact anything you are working on! Very thankful for the information and support from this site. 

[Wolf]

Whale – This. Is. One. Amazing. Pet. By-Law. #justsayin

[Wolf]

@Whale said:

Therefore it’s Model By-Law 16 of the NSW Strata Schemes Management Act (SCMA) that applies, and I would have thought that, together with the incorrect information/wording provided by the Owners Corporation, would be grounds for the whole procedure of you seeking consent to be again commenced.

That’s not accurate, Whale. The OC did give us the correct by-laws i.e. the Model by law 16 when we purchased. I typed in the wrong one on this forum! Sorry for the confusion. 

Also – we would have accepted a conditional approval. In fact, we suggested a trial period in our application for the dog i.e. a 2 week period for us, the rest of the OC and the dog itself to see how everything would settle down. The EC immediately asked “What would it take you to return her if we gave you a trial period?” 

Hardly a fair trial, if that’s their first response! I said that substantiated written complaints would be sufficient evidence that it wasn’t working out. 

They refused us a trial period. 

Thanks so much for your feedback – I’m feeling pretty defeated at this point and don’t know if it’s worth convening an EGM (this was also the legal advice given to us by Bannermans) as at the Annual General Meeting, most owners were okay with cats and small dogs; the shelter dog we are looking at is 20kg, so she’s not small! Unsure if we would get the rest of the owners’ support. 

I believe that I’ve exhausted all NCAT-related options, as I’ve lost the adjudication and am 99% certain my appeal is also lost. 

I’m thinking that the my only option would be to give up our shelter dog (who has spent the majority of this year in a kennel waiting a decision from this saga), much as it breaks my heart, and re-apply for another type, breed, age, etc of dog?

Though it would be hard to find another dog that would fit apartment living so well – it took us 2 months to find this one! Also, given how entrenched my EC is, my feeling is that they would continue to say no to us, no matter what type, breed or age of dog we chose. 

[Wolf]

Whale said 
 
The wording of your Plan’s By-Law adds no value to the above so I’m wondering if, despite your Solicitor’s reviewing the Strata Report, your Plan’s Pet By-Law is properly Registered and therefore shown as a “dealing” on the Plan’s Strata Title Document?
 

Whale – Apologies, I’ve quoted the wrong by-law. We are under the Strata Scheme Management Act 1996 Schedule 1, so the applicable by-law is By-Law 16 from the Model By-Laws. It’s almost the same as what I quoted above, except no fish are allowed without permission either.

I can confirm that there was nothing additional on the Strata Plan’s Title Document regarding a change to the by-law regarding animals – I reviewed this myself, both at purchase and when we were gathering our evidence for the adjudication process. There was an additional by-law registered and noted on the Title Document, but it did not concern the pet by-law at all – from memory I think it was around parking in the visitor’s parking spaces.

[Wolf]

Just as an additional query – the EC said to me that I should have requested their permission to have a dog before I purchased the property. 

Is this an accepted procedure and would this entail a prospective purchaser contacting the strata managing agent to ask them to forward a pet application to the Owners Corporation? 

[Wolf]

Whale – this is our by law:

1) You must obtain the prior written approval of the Owners Corporation, before keeping any animal, except fish in a secure aquarium, on a Lot or the Common Property.

2) The approval of the Owners Corporation cannot be unreasonably withheld

We have the by-laws in writing and informed our solicitor of how important it was that the building didn’t ban dogs, as that was a major factor for us when we purchased. With that view, he reviewed the strata report and by-laws and confirmed that the by-law did not outright ban dogs. I also checked the by-laws before purchase just for my own peace of mind! 

There was no record of any other animals being allowed in the block

What I meant here was that the strata search did not show any record of previous pet applications being sent to the Owners Corp, and so there was no record of them approving or denying any pet application. There was no information one way or the other to indicate how dog friendly the building was before I purchased – all I had to rely on was the by-law. 

During the EC meeting when they discussed my application (I was present as an owner) it came out that years ago a tenant had a dog without permission. The dog was allowed to poop on the balcony and the owner then washed it off onto the unit beneath. Horrifying stuff, so I understood their concerns and tried to allay them by confirming that the dog is potty trained on grass, and committed to not allowing the dog on the balcony unsupervised, and ensuring she had an indoor potty to use. We were not ever planning on leaving her outside on the balcony; while at work we were planning to confine her in our tiled kitchen with the indoor potty, so to my mind there was no risk of this occurring. Anyway, the EC sent the tenant a Notice to Comply, and the dog was removed.

However, there was nothing in the strata report that indicated this past history. Had there been we would have progressed with the purchase with more caution as it would have been a red flag that the building wasn’t dog friendly. We conducted our own search a few months back and there are definitely no minutes on record to indicate that a Notice to Comply was sent to get rid of a dog.

Also, cats are allowed in the building and no written permission is necessary. During the meeting I was asked “why don’t you have a cat” and “why don’t you move out and buy a house if you want a dog.”

These guys have lived here for 35 years – a fact they constantly remind me of – so why haven’t they, at some point in the 35 years changed the by-law to one that banned dogs? Had they done this I would never have bought into this strata scheme and this whole farce could have been avoided. 

The EC did try to change the by law to the Option C Model by law, which bans all animals, during this years AGM, halfway through the adjudication process. We flyer-ed the other owners, who all turned up (to the surprise of the 4 EC members, one of whom remarked that it was the biggest turn out in years) and the motion was defeated with 45% of the poll voting to keep the “pet-friendly” by law. 

These people frighten me.  More Soothsaying – who’s living there, the cast from Macbeth?

JimmyT – you made me lol! Thank you for your response, it’s made me feel a little better! 

[Author]

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