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  • #65559
    newb
    Flatchatter

      I’m reading through the new Property and Stock Agents Regulation 2022
      under the
      Property and Stock Agents Act 2002, care of Victor Dominello.

      And so far it’s a pleasure.

      A shame these can’t be applied retrospectively.

      Eg.

      Code of conduct

      Record of trust account transactions…

      I’m looking forward to reading schedule 4 and schedule 12

    Viewing 15 replies - 1 through 15 (of 16 total)
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    • #65565
      Jimmy-T
      Keymaster

        So, no quotes or links?  Are we supposed to hunt these down and work out what got you so excited?

        The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
        #65573
        newb
        Flatchatter
        Chat-starter

          Apologies, pre emptive excitement. I’ve not finished reading it yet, and need to compare old to new, to see what is actually new. Then there’s the question if it’s actually applied in practice.

          Yes I thought there’d be people on this forum who would be excited too and go have a look, or may have already read it and could give their take on it.

          Some things that looked good so far, (on my way to work, I’ll add more later)-

          41. Records to be prepared by strata managing agent

          (3) A copy of each record must be provided to the treasurer of the owners corporation or association at the following times—
          (a) if the agent ceases to act as managing agent for the owners corporation or association—within 14 days after termination of the agency agreement,
          (b) otherwise—at least once in every 3 month period.

          42. Contents of record to be prepared by strata managing agent
          (1) Each record required to be prepared by a strata managing agent under section 41 must—
          (a) state the name and address of the owners corporation or association for whom the record is prepared, and
          (b) specify the period in relation to which the record is prepared, and
          (c) state the date of the record, and
          (d) if the record is required because of the termination of an agency agreement— reconcile all receipts and payments with the statements from the relevant authorised deposit-taking institution up to the time of termination.

          43. Managing agent to permit strata and association committees to inspect records

          There is also a new inclusion that a strata manager has to cooperate in handing over to an owners corporation moving to self management, or when there is no new strata manager to hand over to. (I need to go back and find the reference).

          This is the link to the Regulation

          https://comms.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au/link/id/zzzz6333c0ab315a1060Pzzzz62b0113959e03584/page.html

           

           

          #65628
          newb
          Flatchatter
          Chat-starter

            I found the reference about cooperating with handover:

            Schedule 4 Rules specific to strata managing agents and assistant strata managing agents
            section 8
            1 Co-operation about records, access and transfer
            (1) If an agent is acting on behalf of a person in the management of a property and is advised by another agent that the other agent (the new agent) has been engaged to act
            on behalf of the person in the management of the property, the agent must co-operate with the new agent—
            (a) in relation to access to the records of the person, including by making the records reasonably available, according to law, and
            (b) by facilitating the transfer of management functions between the agent and the new agent.
            (2) Subsection (3) applies if an agent is acting on behalf of an owners corporation or association in the management of a property and is advised by the owners
            corporation or association that—
            (a) the agent is no longer to act on behalf of the owners corporation or association,
            and
            (b) no other agent is being appointed.
            (3) The agent must co-operate with the owners corporation or association—
            (a) in relation to access to the records of the owners corporation or association,
            including by making the records reasonably available, according to law, and
            (b) by facilitating the transfer of management functions between the agent and the
            owners corporation or association.

            I’ll add more about other sections when I have time to go over it all thoroughly.

             

            #65686
            TrulEConcerned
            Flatchatter

              1. To me the glaring omission in this “reform” is that no change seems to have been made as to how NSW Fair Trading enforces  compliance with the Act.

              That is to say, before this “reform”, a complaint by Joe Public against a real estate agent (including a strata agent) required a complainant to:

              A. Write to NSW FT by formally listing allegations of say misconduct or dishonesty, which are breaches of the Act under which the agent is licensed; and

              B. Provide evidence to back the allegations.

              NSW FT would consider the matter and decide if compliance action is needed, for instance:

              (i) Directing the agent (strictly  speaking, licensee in charge) to further education; or

              (ii) Sending the licensee in charge a warning letter; or

              (iii) Fining the licensee in charge; or

              (iv) Taking more serious steps.

              The complainant would at no time be informed:

              * If NSW FT took compliance action at all against the licensee and

              * What if anything, the licensee said, wrote or inferred in reply to NSW FT.

              Oh, and the agent could conceal the matter entirely from the OC, if he so chose.

              The “reform” keeps all the above in place.

              The above is not what I consider remotely  “consumer protection”. It’s “industry protection”.

              #65689
              newb
              Flatchatter
              Chat-starter

                Why is this industry protected? In our case I seriously wondered if my strata managers’ real clients were his developer clients, and running our building and works fund down (devaluing our building and driving us up the creek without a paddle, ripe for a predatory developer) his real business.

                I was thinking a lot of strata manager issues could be solved by having the strata roll visible to owners on strata hub, making it illegal for strata managers to charge an exit fee, and only allowing month to month contracts. Then they’d actually be accountable to their clients, or lose their clients business, like any other working person is. It would also be handy if owners corporation money could be held by an independent body, like tenants bonds are.

                The current system is not sustainable.

                #65725
                TrulEConcerned
                Flatchatter

                  @newb

                  You wrote

                  Why is this industry protected?

                  In the context of strata schemes, I meant the real estate agents are protected from facing the full force of what is considered “consumer protection” legislation as say KMART faces with its customers.

                  You wrote

                  I was thinking a lot of strata manager issues could be solved by having the strata roll visible to owners on strata hub

                  Forget the strata hub. The strata roll is not listed there; as far as I know only the Chair, Secretary and agent (if there is one) details are listed. Maybe one day the roll will be listed there, who knows?

                  But as for today, you as an owner are allowed to view the strata roll (which I assume lists names, phone numbers and email addresses). After all, the strata roll forms part of the strata’s records (under the control of the Owners’ Corp be it with the strata committee or the strata agent) which every owner has the legal right to inspect.

                  Of course the agent may be a so-and-so and not provide the data you want quickly and simply and instead may insist on you paying the (no less than) $34 inspection access fee, but even so, you should get all the details you’re after.

                  Here’s an idea: tell your agent you’re interested in contacting all owners about (mention some important matter) and for that you would like their names and email addresses to be sent to you (in no longer than say 3 days’ time).

                  The agent cannot deny you that. Oh, if he or a committee member says he cannot due to “privacy” concerns, tell him to check with NSW Fair Trading (13 32 20). One committee I deal with pulled that stunt (denying me an email address) and quickly behaved themselves when NSW Fair Trading set them straight.

                   

                  #65727
                  Jimmy-T
                  Keymaster

                    tell your agent you’re interested in contacting all owners about (mention some important matter) and for that you would like their names and email addresses to be sent to you (in no longer than say 3 days’ time). The agent cannot deny you that.

                    Are you sure?  I don’t recall anything in the legislation that says the agent must forward owners anything.  You are right about allowing inspection for a nominal fee.  Take your phone and photograph or scan the lists to save you photocopying fees, if you want.

                    The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                    #65731
                    newb
                    Flatchatter
                    Chat-starter

                      @TrulEConcerned

                      I think eventually the strata roll, or enough details for owners to contact other owners, will be available on strata hub.

                      It is interesting, in these SCA webinars (below)  about the [then] upcoming strata hub, how uncomfortable SCA reps are about the prospect of this info being freely available between owners. They cite wanting to protect their committee.

                      As the Fair Trading guy said, being available for communication with owners is an integral part of being on a committee. I believe that strata managers are more concerned with maintaining control through making it difficult for owners to communicate with each other. Divide and conquer.

                      I did get the strata roll and it was key to being able to contact owners and get together and vote to not renew with our strata manager. Strata manager tried to charge hundreds of dollars for it but provided the requested records within 14 days after I told them they couldn’t charge more than the prescribed fee. Plus I was and am a committee member.

                      Records have to be provided to the committee within 14 days, not 3 days. And as Jimmy said any owner can inspect the records for a nominal fee.

                      And they have to be provided regularly as part of the services they are paid for. (Strata schemes management Act part 4 division 3, and part 10 detail this).

                      Here is a video of a NSW Strata Community Association (the strata managers’ professional body) webinar on the Strata Hub.

                       

                       

                       

                      #65734
                      Jimmy-T
                      Keymaster

                        I think eventually the strata roll, or enough details for owners to contact other owners, will be available on strata hub.

                        I hope you are right but I have my doubts.  There has already been resistance from committee office-bearers to having to post their personal phone numbers and email addresses.  Not sure if I would want my contact details and address posted on the internet where outsiders might access it.  One word: Optus.

                        The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                        #65748
                        TrulEConcerned
                        Flatchatter

                          @Jimmy

                          I wrote “forward” because in my recent experience – unless there is a lot of wading to do (by the agent in order to seek hunt down the sought after information) – agents prefer to email or direct owners to the portal rather than have them turn up at their office to inspect records

                          Of course there is nothing stopping an agent emailing information to owners on condition of paying the “inspection fee”.

                          #65745
                          newb
                          Flatchatter
                          Chat-starter

                            A big part of the issue has been owners lack of involvement or desire to be involved though. It doesn’t take much to put most people off.

                            #65744
                            newb
                            Flatchatter
                            Chat-starter

                              @Jimmy-T the solution they came up with was a generic/ specific email for committee, eg. Chair @blahblah. And this could be done for everyone. Create a specific email for your strata scheme, that you can be contacted on.

                              We now have a portal and people are free to use it or not use it. The main thing is that people can communicate if they want to.

                              The delay in getting hold of info, digesting it, working out what to do and then discussing with all owners, cost us thousands of dollars.

                              #65876
                              The Hood
                              Flatchatter

                                tell your agent you’re interested in contacting all owners about (mention some important matter) and for that you would like their names and email addresses to be sent to you (in no longer than say 3 days’ time). The agent cannot deny you that.

                                Are you sure? I don’t recall anything in the legislation that says the agent must forward owners anything. You are right about allowing inspection for a nominal fee. Take your phone and photograph or scan the lists to save you photocopying fees, if you want.

                                Take your phone and camera??
                                SP***** (self managed at the time) made me take hand notes and refused to allow me to photocopy (even on my own copier) or take pictures.
                                Just be nasty but nowhere does the Act prohibit the OC from being nasty.
                                Seems they were happy to make access to the roll as difficult as possible because some owners objected to the information being available. And this inspection only took place after the OC was ordered to make the documents available.

                                Lots of talk in the Act about ‘allow inspection’ and ‘make available’ but little on how copies are to be taken.

                                183 (4) A person entitled to inspect a document may take extracts from, or make a copy of, the
                                document but must not, without the consent of the owners corporation, remove the document
                                from the custody of the owners corporation.

                                Sure we all have our own idea of what ‘make a copy’ involves but what we think actually means nothing. We need to know what the Courts say it means because that is what it means.

                                #65875
                                The Hood
                                Flatchatter

                                  I’m reading through the new Property and Stock Agents Regulation 2022

                                  under the

                                  Property and Stock Agents Act 2002, care of Victor Dominello.

                                  And so far it’s a pleasure.

                                  A shame these can’t be applied retrospectively.

                                  Eg.

                                  Code of conduct

                                  Record of trust account transactions…

                                  I’m looking forward to reading schedule 4 and schedule 12

                                  The Code of Conduct is worthless window dressing and if you want to be realistic about it then you will realize it sets an impossible bar.

                                  1   Knowledge of Act and regulations

                                  An agent must have a knowledge and understanding of the Act and the regulations under the Act, and such other laws relevant to the category of licence or certificate of registration held (including, laws relating to residential tenancy, fair trading, competition and consumer protection, anti-discrimination and privacy) as may be necessary to enable the agent to exercise his or her functions as agent lawfully.

                                  #65885
                                  Jimmy-T
                                  Keymaster

                                    The Code of Conduct is worthless window dressing and if you want to be realistic about it then you will realize it sets an impossible bar.

                                    Previously I would have agreed with that 100 per cent but SCA NSW has only recently had its Professional Standards papers officially accepted and they include its own, government approved, code of conduct.  So you now have a benchmark by which to measure the standards of your strata managers’ behaviour. OK, it’s more of a wish-list than window dressing, for now, but it’s a start.

                                    The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
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