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    I live in a 4 unit strata title that is we self manage. All four owners are on the exec committee. Of the 4 units in the strata 3 have unit entitlements of 260 and 1 has unit entitlements of 300. One of the owners of the 4 units ( for convenience I will refer to this person as 'Fred' – this is not their real name) voluntered to do the main tasks of running the strata e.g. collecting levies, managing maintenance, paying insurance etc. Fred has been doing this for about 2 years. The strata contributes to Fred's costs for this e.g. phone bills, postage etc. Fred now wants to be paid some money from the strata for their time and effort in this. THerefore Fred person put forward a motion at the our last meeting that they be paid $600 for running the strata. When we voted at the meeting it was 2 votes for (nb. one of these votes was from the unit with the unit entitlement of 300) and 2 against. OUr dispute now is whether this motion passed or not. Fred believes that the motion passed as he says from the 'Poll vote' method they have more unit entitlement votes for the motion (i.e. 560 for to 520 against).

     

    I have read the strata booklet and it mentions about resolutions and special resolutions and the different voting methods needed to pass these motions )i.e. special resolutions need 75% majority by unit entitlement), however it does not define what a special resolution is or what a normal resolution is. Could it be claimed that as Fred has a financial benefit to gain from this vote that they should abstain from voting. If they did abstain from the vote then it would have been 2 votes against and 1 for.

     

    Also the meeting when this motion was voted on was not an AGM, does this make any difference?

     

    Could you please provide any advice on if this motion passed or not? And how to determine how a vote should be decided on when it is tied?

Viewing 5 replies - 1 through 5 (of 5 total)
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  • #14056
    Billen Ben
    Flatchatter

      Hi unlucky,
      A 2 -2 vote fails by definition because there was no majority. A tied vote means a motion fails.

      What was the understanding of how the vote was being done?

      If the vote was a show of hands vote, one hand = one vote, then the motion failed but if the vote had been by poll then the motion passed.

      If it was by poll then what method did the Chair adopt – polls are generally done on paper and are determined based on entitlement. A poll can be by show of hands where the hand represents the unit entitlement but it needs to be clear the vote is a poll.

      A motion to pay an EC member for their toil (volunteer work) needs to be an AGM motion, the EC cannot pass such a motion, and if you want it to pass such a motion at the AGM then it seems you will need to demand a poll when the motion is put to the meeting.

      There is no need for the beneficiary of a motion to pay an EC member to abstain but it is arguably more ethical for them to leave the matter to those who are deciding if they are worthy.

      Hope the above helps.

      #14059
      clive2000
      Flatchatter

        You need to get real and stop being so technical. Fred is doing your OC a favour. It would cost a lot more than $600 to have a professional strata manager. If your block is run harmoniously, why put it in jeopardy by being so mean? Ultimately, if Fred gets his act together and convenes the proper meeting and demands a poll, he and the other unit with 300 will prevail, and in the meantime, you would have created disharmony and wasted time and money.

        #14061
        Jimmy-T
        Keymaster

          I don't disagree with Clive that Fred deserves to be paid for his work but, especially when it comes to financial matters, it's better to be squeaky clean, legally.  Here is what the Strata Act says:

          25   Can members of the executive committee be paid?

          An owners corporation may pay to a person who is the chairperson, secretary, treasurer or a member of the executive committee such amount as the owners corporation determines at an annual general meeting in recognition of services performed by the person for the owners corporation in the period since the last annual general meeting.

          Couldn't be clearer than that.

          The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
          #14064
          Billen Ben
          Flatchatter

            clive2000 said:

            You need to get real and stop being so technical. Fred is doing your OC a favour. It would cost a lot more than $600 to have a professional strata manager. If your block is run harmoniously, why put it in jeopardy by being so mean? Ultimately, if Fred gets his act together and convenes the proper meeting and demands a poll, he and the other unit with 300 will prevail, and in the meantime, you would have created disharmony and wasted time and money.

            Hi Clive,
            If Fred doesn't know better than to bring up a motion about getting paid at an EC meeting then what other things is he doing that are not correct and i would add to that if the other 3 EC members are prepared to run the SP for nothing then Fred is a big expensive.

            Six hundred dollars is a lot in a four unit block. That is $150 per unit increase in levy.

            It's a four unit block. One person who knows a bit of strata, can do high school level math and can read should be able to run it without giving up their day job. 

            If you shop around you might find someone, an agency, prepared to do Freds work for less than $600. Agents get nice insurance kick backs and it is trivial to manage a 4 unit strata. Do not be surprised if you do find someone.

            I would like to drop a few names but will just say look at agencies that rely on technology as they can often provide good services at a good price. One of my favorite agents leads the industry in electronic management practices and can therefore offer much better prices per unit to manage SP's.

            “The legislation has always envisaged that generally, strata schemes would be managed by ordinary lot owners for their own benefit….”
            J Bordon: Nulama Village P/L v Owners Strata Plan 61788 (Strata & Community Schemes) [2006] NSWCTTT 550 (25 September 2006)

            The whole idea was that small blocks of units could look after themselves for no real cost to owners. Just because an agent would cost more than volunteers should not make payment motions for volunteers a given.

            It was Fred who put up the motion, the motion was out of order – I'd pay for that sort of management – NOT!; I am being a little hard.

            I appreciate what Fred is doing for his SP but if he wants money to continue and people are voting no then these people must be prepared to step up if Fred walks.

            I am assuming the others will rise to the challenge.

            Why pay an agent when you can  pay Fred a lot less?? If that is really the case.

            Why pay Fred when the others will do it for free??

            #14068
            Jimmy-T
            Keymaster

              A few points to consider:

              1.  The average cost of strata management fees is about $200 per unit.

              2. Most strata management firms agree that the money they raise from small blocks  doesn't adequately compensate for the time spent managing them.

              3. Many small block residents complain that they don't get the level of service from strata managers that they desire (see point 2).

              4. Managing a building, even a small one takes time, effort and energy.

              Personally, I'd be saying to Fred, if he'd completed one of the many courses available for executive committee members, then he could ask for the money retrospectively, as per the Act.  But if he wants pay, rather than a 'consideration” after the matter, he needs to get a strata management license.

              The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
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