Flat Chat Strata Forum Strata Committees Elections Current Page

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  • #74586
    timSP
    Flatchatter

      NSW.

      Just recieved our AGM notice. (motions regarding committee attached)

      The current committee members are the only committee nominees.

      There is no facility to vote on individual committee nominees.

      There was no call for any new nominee’s

      I have been told, and am of the understanding that the elected of the committee CANNOT be undertaken if the meeting is held via electronic vote/paper form vote. Is this correct?

      Is what they have done legal?

      From past experience, it is clearly part of a concerted plan to exclude any new committee nominates and keeping the current members.

      This isn’t valid surely?

      What can be done?

      AGM is due to be held last week in June.

      • This topic was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by .
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    • #74636
      StrataChair
      Flatchatter
      (from NSW)

        Hi timSP,

        The relevant part of the legislation is Schedule 1 to the Strata Schemes Management Act and the Strata Schemes Management Regulation. [not sure why but I can’t put a link to this here…]

        You’re right. You can’t vote on the committee electronically. per s14A(a) of the Regulation: ‘an election must not be determined by pre-meeting electronic voting.’

        The notice of meeting must include a call for nominations per s 5(1) of Schedule 1

        A nomination may be made in writing before the meeting or orally at the meeting per s5(5).

        This is reiterated in the Regulation s 9 and 10.

        So decide your timing carefully. If there is a physical/electronic meeting at a particular time and place (as there needs to be to elect a committee) you could simply ensure you are there, nominate orally and point out that any pre-meeting electronic votes for the committee are invalid per the Regulation.

        Note also that, per s9(e) of Sched 1 there must be a ‘…motion to decide the number of members of the strata committee’ as well as a motion for their election per s9(f).

        Hope this helps! Good luck!

        #74644
        Jimmy-T
        Keymaster

          Would it be worth taking pre-emptive action at NCAT via a complaint and interim order?

          The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
          #74669
          timSP
          Flatchatter
          Chat-starter

            Thanks @jimmyt53 @StrataChair for your responses.

             


            @StrataChair

            So decide your timing carefully. If there is a physical/electronic meeting at a particular time and place (as there needs to be to elect a committee) you could simply ensure you are there, nominate orally and point out that any pre-meeting electronic votes for the committee are invalid per the Regulation.

            Regarding your suggestion above, Just to clarify, there will be no physical meeting, its paper vote online. (even though a date and time is specified as the strata managers offices) but I say this is just a formality needed to include to say a “meeting” was held.


            @jimmyt53

            Would it be worth taking pre-emptive action at NCAT via a complaint and interim order?

            Yes good idea. Although, it the motions regarding the committee election are indeed ruled null and void, I wonder does the committee retain their positions?

            We continually have this issue where the incumbent committee hold AGM meetings via electronic paper vote so as to NOT to hold a committee election and therefor retain their positions year on year. Not to mention the fact that our strata plan never has an opportunity to discuss matter relating to the running of out plan. Extremely infuriating!

             

            #74702
            StrataChair
            Flatchatter
            (from NSW)

              @timSP,

              Another suggestion: get a copy of the strata roll from your strata manager (and yes, the law requires them to give it to you) and write to other owners pointing out this is unlawful.

              If you want to make it really stick, pay a lawyer to do this on your behalf.

              Good luck!

              #74709
              Jimmy-T
              Keymaster

                Another suggestion: get a copy of the strata roll from your strata manager (and yes, the law requires them to give it to you) and write to other owners pointing out this is unlawful.

                Expect to be told that since the strata manager is also the secretary (under certain circumstances) then the strata roll has already been provided.  Also expect to be told that because of privacy concerns, you will not be given the email addresses of owners, even though they are an essential part of the roll.

                Both of these arguments are total BS.

                I had a huge fight with Netstrata over this at our investment property and, by the way. the strata commissioner declined to say who was right and wrong in this fight.

                If the committee members are already playing fast and loose with the law, I would expect them to go to the barricades on this too.  Apply for mediation at Fair Trading, seek an interim order and then see what falls out when you shake them up.

                The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                #74751
                Strata Answers
                Flatchatter
                (from NSW)

                  Just reading through the posts…timSP says the AGM is a ...”paper online vote”... so presumably this is not just a meeting decided by pre-meeting voting by email / mail etc but an actual ONLINE  meeting.

                  I couldn’t see the copy of the Notice of Meeting but has the SM provided a Zoom / Teams link for the meeting ?

                  In any event you could ask for a link so as to attend and follow the advice of StrataChair….

                  “So decide your timing carefully. If there is a physical/electronic meeting at a particular time and place (as there needs to be to elect a committee) you could simply ensure you are there, nominate orally and point out that any pre-meeting electronic votes for the committee are invalid per the Regulation.”

                  #74798
                  timSP
                  Flatchatter
                  Chat-starter

                     

                    Thanks @Jimmy-T

                    If the committee members are already playing fast and loose with the law, I would expect them to go to the barricades on this too.  Apply for mediation at Fair Trading, seek an interim order and then see what falls out when you shake them up.

                    Yes Good idea I will do that. Committee and strata manager extremely belligerent and are doing whatever they please, whether legal or not. They are waiting for owners to chase them in court, NCAT or fair trading, which just cost lot owners more money.

                     

                     

                    #74797
                    timSP
                    Flatchatter
                    Chat-starter

                      @Strata-Answers

                      Just reading through the posts…timSP says the AGM is a ...”paper online vote”... so presumably this is not just a meeting decided by pre-meeting voting by email / mail etc but an actual ONLINE  meeting.

                      Just to clarify, there will be NO physical meeting, its “pre-meeting paper vote”. (even though a date and time is specified as the strata managers offices) but I say this is just a formality needed to include to say a “meeting” was held.

                      This has been the case for the last 3 years AGM, (apart from one EGM held via zoom). So it CAN be held by zoom, but SC choose this form so no discussions or questions can be asked, PLUS the retain their postions on the committee. Brilliant isnt it?!!!

                      #74801
                      Jimmy-T
                      Keymaster

                        I get the feeling that a lawyer’s letter, from an experienced strata lawyer, reminding the committee of their legal obligations, might work wonders here.  Shouldn’t be too expensive and would make them realise the seriousness of their situation.

                        Failing that, if you could get something in writing out of Fair Trading, that might do the trick.

                        The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                        #74849
                        Jimmy-T
                        Keymaster

                          Just to clarify, there will be NO physical meeting, its “pre-meeting paper vote”. (even though a date and time is specified as the strata managers offices) but I say this is just a formality needed to include to say a “meeting” was held.

                          Then the election of the committee is invalid, according to the Strata Schemes Regulation

                          14A   Pre-meeting electronic voting

                          For the Act, Schedule 1, clause 28(3) and Schedule 2, clause 10(3), the following applies in relation to voting by pre-meeting electronic voting—

                          (a)  an election must not be determined by pre-meeting electronic voting,

                          The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
                          #74880
                          timSP
                          Flatchatter
                          Chat-starter

                            as the AGM which is to be held via pre meeting paper vote, there No actual in person meeting.

                            Question:

                            Are the Voting forms post vote required to be made available for lot owners to view, so that the votes can be verified?
                            Are they considered “records of the plan”?
                            How can the voting be verified, including any proxy votes?

                            I know that one suggestion will be “just request a strata search”, but due to past experiences the strata manager  will most likely ensure that it will be extremely difficult for the voting to be verified.

                            #74919
                            Jimmy-T
                            Keymaster

                              The various Acts say the records of electronic voting must be retained and mad available to owners on request.

                               

                              From the Regulations (sl-2016-501 (nsw.gov.au)_

                              41 Electronic voting records
                              (1)For the purposes of section 180 (1) (j) of the Act, records relating to electronic voting
                              for motions for resolutions by an owners corporation must be retained by an owners
                              corporation.
                              (2)For the purposes of section 180 (2) of the Act, the period for which an owners
                              corporation is required to retain voting papers under section 180 (1) (g) of the Act or
                              records referred to in subclause (1) is 13 months, if the voting papers or records relate
                              to secret ballots, unless the papers relate to the appointment of a strata renewal
                              committee or other decisions in connection with Part 10 of the Strata Schemes
                              Development Act 2015.
                              42 Inspection of records
                              For the purposes of section 182 (3) (k) of the Act, the owners corporation must make
                              available for inspection the accounting records and other records relating to the strata
                              scheme that are kept by the strata managing agent.

                              You’ll find the relevant sections of the Act here: https://legislation.nsw.gov.au/view/html/inforce/current/act-2015-050#pt.10-div.2

                               

                              The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
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