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Topic
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G’day folks,
I’m a tenant. My partner and I moved in a couple months back to a freestanding house. It’s not in great condition, but it locks up securely and the essentials work.
I’ve made a number of minor repairs since I moved in instead of getting the owner to pay tradespeople (new toilet seat, new shower rail, fixed almost every blind that was falling off, cleaned up a very large amount of builders waste and rubbish from under the house. I have a gardener taking care of the outside. I’ve never been late on rent ever in my life. I think I’m a great tenant
The house has an induction stove. It’s the first one either of us have ever used.u partner fumbled a small glass spice jar from the cupboard over the range extractor and it fell right on the corner of the cooktop glass and cracked it. Apparently this is common knowledge and the advice is never store anything heavy above one. Neither of us had any idea, and it’s not in the very comprehensive list of “don’ts” in the lease.
The stove still works fine but clearly needs to be replaced.
My property manager is sympathetic but says we have to pay the whole cost of replacement and installation. We can either arrange it ourselves or they will do it at exit.
I feel this is unfair as I intend to move within 6 months and the owner gets to keep a new stovetop I paid for. The existing stove one was only a few years old but was a no-name brand and had burnt in marks from previous tenants.
A stove is expected to last around 10 years (ACL). If I only get 0.5 years use from the one I paid for it seems like the owner should contribute. Although, the other way to look at it is there was a working stove, I damaged it, I have to make it right again.
I think a 2/3 split would be reasonable. What do you guys think.
Cheers
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It’s not what you think is right, it’s what the landlord considers right.
You are correct in saying that the stovetop has a depreciated value. That’s what you would be expected to pay if you took it to NCAT.. You need to do your research. How much is a new stove top that’s equivalent (not some cheap brand). How old is it? Calculate the depreciated value. Put that to the landlord and see what he says.
If the landlord does not agree, at the end of your lease you can dispute this through NCAT.
Don’t buy a new stove top because it’s unlikely you will get your money back unless the landlord agrees to some payment.
Unfortunately you have damaged the stove top and are liable to reinstate it to the previous condition.
I think a 2/3 split would be reasonable. What do you guys think.
I think the landlord should have Landlord Insurance and you should have Home and Contents. Failing both, see Kaindub’s post above.
The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
If the landlord has insurance offer to pay the excess.
A few things come to mind:
- What is the current value of the stove? Given my experience at NCAT over damage to carpets, I suggest that the NCAT Member will look at your situation as follows:
Say it is a cheap brand (that is still sold);
Say it cost $500 and has 10 yr life.
Its value therefore depreciates by $50 per annum. If we assume 4 years have passed at the point you damaged
it,the stove is now worth $300 (ie. $50 x 6) depreciate by $50 per annum and 4 years have passed when you damaged it.
The length of your lease beyond the time it was damaged is irrelevant to this calculation.
So its value now is $500 minus (4 x $50) which is $300
Based on the above figures, NCAT I feel would say the value of the item you damaged which you yourself agree needs to be replaced as it cannot operate in its current condition is say, $300. That means your maximum liability is $300.
I suggest you look (but do not buy) for a replacement stove of the same standard, cheap, and give details to the property manager. Tell the property mgr that if the stove was in good condition but for the damage you inflicted, then no Tribunal would order you pay more than its undepreciated cost which in this case is $300. But the stove was not in good nick before being damaged by you. That is, its depreciated value was more than $200 meaning its current value is LESS than $300 given a previous tenant left marks. You therefore feel a fair contribution by you given the condition you received the stove is $200.
Taking my figures as an example, in your shoes I would push for paying $200 but steel myself for a demand for anything up to $300.
If the landlord takes you to NCAT he will have to prove the value of the stove with invoices, photos etc.
As to the suggestion of the landlord claiming on his insurance for what is called “Tenant Damage”, some recommend you pay the excess in that case. I think a landlord will not want to claim on his insurance because his future premiums may rise due to this claim. Also with well known one insurer I know of, such claims have an excess of $500, so clearly you’re better off even paying the $300 that may be asked of you.
Say it cost $500 and has 10 yr life. Its value therefore depreciates by $50 per annum. If we assume 4 years have passed at the point you damaged
The depreciation principle may be right (although I’m not sure that it equates with carpets) but there are a lot of assumptions based on dubious figures here. The smallest standard “no-name” induction stove is going to cost upwards of $800. If it’s a name brand, you can double that.
Drant should ask when the landlord bought the stove and how much they paid for it. Then they can start the arm wrestle of who pays how much for what.
The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
A call to customer service for the brand may be in order. The glass should be available as a replacement part. The induction coils and other workings sit below the glass. The economy of this would depend upon the after sales service of the particular brand.
This seems to be a landlord and tenant matter rather than a strata issue? Though I imagine Flatchatters who are investors/landlords would be very interested.
This seems to be a landlord and tenant matter rather than a strata issue? Though I imagine Flatchatters who are investors/landlords would be very interested.
Just over 50 percent of apartment residents are tenants, so around 50 percent of apartment owners are landlords. That makes it relevant, in my book.
Also, I had a look around for the price on a second-hand induction cooktop on Gumtree. One was for sale because it had been cracked by a falling pepper mill. Maybe there should be a warning about storing heavy stuff above them.
The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
One option would be to buy a couple of Ikea portable induction single ring cooktops. They could sit on top of the damaged cooktop. They are about $50 each and work well plugged into an ordinary power point. We have one we carry in our camper trailer. Since you plan to leave in 6 months, this would give you something good to cook on now and you can take them with you. With the pressure for a quick solution removed, you can explore the options others have suggested at a more leisurely pace.
Drant, you mention the stove can be bought from Bunnings for $450.
If you do go to QCAT ensure your claim is COMPLETE and include:
Cost of stove say $450 (attach evidence of two options in case the $450 model is unavailable)
Cost to deliver & take away the old stove (attach evidence)
Cost to install (electrician for which you must get a quote)
If you don’t get a quotes and attach proof to your claim, you will not be putting your bet foot forward.
I feel there is a principle at stake here … I just can’t articulate it.
‘I broke it, but if I fix it i will only get 6 month’s use of it’
vs
You broke it, replace it (at least to the same standard) and this includes installation etc
I thought that tenants could claim ‘wear and tear’ on items?
Jo
Principle does not equal lawful.
Remember, despite the fact you bought the cooktop, what you are doing is replacing the LANDLORDS property.
As a tenant you are protected from mischievous claims by the landlord. This means you are can’t be charged for fair wear and tear on items.
If I recall , earlier posts suggested to negotiate with the landlord about the replacement cost of the cooktop. The cooktop had already served some of its useful life, so it’s not worth it’s full replacement value.But you were advised that that route was probably going to not end well for you, and an alternative was to just replace the cooktop.
Our tenants laws favour landlords, and landlords can play hardball, because they know that if they don’t renew you, or you decide to leave, there are many more like you willing to rent the property.
Unless you can find a source of second-hand stovetops of a similar quality, it’s off to the shops for you.
The opinions offered in these Forum posts and replies are not intended to be taken as legal advice. Readers with serious issues should consult experienced strata lawyers.
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